The Art of Recovery with Alicia Parrott
SUBSCRIBE ON
Apple Podcasts │ Spotify │ YouTube │ Substack
Description
Alicia Parrott, a street artist known as ShePosse, shares her inspiring journey of recovery from addiction, emphasizing the transformative power of art and community. She reflects on her past struggles, the importance of being present, and the lessons learned throughout her recovery process. Alicia discusses how her art serves as a form of expression and connection, highlighting the significance of vulnerability and breaking the stigma surrounding addiction. Through her story, she encourages others to seek help and confront the issues that are holding them back.
About Alicia Parrott
Alicia Parrott is a multidisciplinary artist, senior graphic designer, and the street artist known as ShePosse. Her work lives at the intersection of recovery and resistance, blending formal fine art training with raw, street-level expression. Sober since 2006, Alicia draws deep parallels between recovery and street art—both rooted in presence, anonymity, and the act of showing up without knowing how long something will last.
She earned her BFA from SUNY Purchase and brings over 25 years of experience to her design career. Her artwork has been exhibited alongside Shepard Fairey and Lady Pink, and is featured in the book Theez Are Our Streez, by Deelaruz. She’s also the co-producer of Sticker Movie, a documentary celebrating global sticker culture.
Working under the name ShePosse, Alicia explores duality—personal and public, soft and sharp, design and rebellion. Her work gives voice to women, especially those often left out of the conversation in both art and recovery spaces. Whether it’s seen in a gallery or found weathered on a street pole, her work is meant to connect, to witness, and to remind others they’re not alone.
She lives and works in Solana Beach, California—but her art shows up in streets worldwide.
Follow Alicia on Instagram at @sheposse
Transcript
Heather Mcginley (00:41)
Well, my guest today is Alicia parrot a street artist who is known online as she posse Alicia is here today to talk about her journey and recovery through addiction and what her life has looked like afterwards
and the importance of art and how the role that it plays in her life today. You just celebrated 19 years sober, which is so amazing. Thank you for being here.
Alicia (01:03)
Thank you, Heather. I'm really excited to be here and more excited to just have a real conversation. Let's talk about life being messy.
Heather Mcginley (01:12)
Yeah.
Yes, and
for all of y'all that are listening, it will be worthwhile for you to check out my Instagram account, that Heather McGee, or watch this on YouTube so that you can see, because we'll show some of Alicia's art so that you can see some of the things that we're looking about here. All right, Alicia, can you talk to us a little bit about what was going on in your life about 20 years ago?
Alicia (01:33)
20 years ago, okay, I was living in Colorado, far away from my friends and family in New York. I was working as a graphic designer as I am today and doing art. Art was always my anchor. But the key difference between then and now is that I was lost. I was lost mentally.
I had been diagnosed with a mental illness at the time. I was getting by at work, you know, seemingly normal during the day. But using drugs and alcohol to numb out, to simply get out of my head. To put it simply, I was not comfortable in my own skin.
Heather Mcginley (02:16)
Well, and I too, you know, Alicia and I used to work together. So I know Alicia on a personal front and you have so much joy and energy and you light up a room when you're there. And something that I've noticed through these conversations is that people have been, that have been through really hard times when you get a second chance or third chance, it really impacts the way you see life and how like much you dive into life and what it is and making the most of it. And I can definitely see that in you.
Alicia (02:27)
Thanks.
Aw, thank you. That means a lot.
Heather Mcginley (02:47)
Now, okay, back then when you talk about being lost, were you trying to, detach from life? Were you trying to avoid things in life what do you think was making you feel lost?
Alicia (02:58)
⁓ That's a really interesting question. aside from simply just not being comfortable with who I was. And there's not an adjective to describe that. It's just something that was very deep. I think that's part of the problem was that I didn't...
want to dig into why am I feeling like this. It was trying to escape any kind of negative, that pit feeling I had in my stomach constantly. When I picked up to use, that made it go away, you know, for whatever the time period was. I used it to...
Heather Mcginley (03:42)
Yeah.
Alicia (03:47)
go out and be social. That's how I pumped myself up to be social because I'm more of an introvert. I used to celebrate. I used to commiserate. I used to go to sleep. And I didn't think, I really didn't think anything of it. That's just how life, that's how I functioned.
Heather Mcginley (04:12)
I hear you and I relate to what you're talking about, because I think I spent a lot of my life trying to avoid things, whether conscious or unconscious, because it was just too hard and too painful, and I was also tired. I was tired. It's exhausting. For you, what is the, because it sounds like from the way you're talking about it, pre-recovery.
Alicia (04:26)
Mmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (04:35)
using was really fueling your life, helping you get out there, to be with other people, to live your life, to get out and get things done. What is that experience life now, now that you are living your life on your own terms, by your own power? What is the contrast there for you?
Alicia (04:53)
The contrast there is that...
When I get uncomfortable, that doesn't mean I need to zone out. That just means I'm having a bad day. That's all it means. And so it's not the end of the world. I could choose to go deeper and think about like, okay, let's think about facts. What's going on?
Heather Mcginley (05:04)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah, it's not the end of the world.
Mm-hmm.
Alicia (05:24)
that is making me feel this way, explore that, or I have the tools to know that this is not gonna last forever. Let's sit down and let's put that nervous energy to art. Because when I'm doing art, mean, everything else just kinda disappears. I'm looking for the next color I'm gonna use.
When I'm getting edgy, go for a run because I'm not thinking about anything other than, you know, let me make it to that tree. ⁓ So I think that's the big contrast. It's just living life on life's terms. Because I can't, you know, we don't have control over many things.
Heather Mcginley (06:02)
Hahaha!
Yeah. Well, did you feel like there was a big difference between like, I know for me, I've gone through a fight to be present in my own life, like to be there in the moment to actually connect to people in a real way. Was that a shift for you as well?
Alicia (06:21)
Mm-hmm.
Huge shift, huge shift. the fact of the matter is I don't do that all the time. I don't do that all the time. I don't do that perfectly. ⁓ But I think that's a shift too, is learning how to just sit in the uncomfortableness.
Heather Mcginley (06:37)
Yeah, right.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Alicia (06:55)
and being present because when you're present, you're able to connect with other people. When you're present, that connection helps you get out of your head and helps you feel that like, I think that's why we're on this earth really is for human connection.
Heather Mcginley (07:12)
Yeah.
I'm having like a little bit of a light bulb moment right now. I think for me, and I would love to know if this resonates with you at all. I think for me at the heart of like avoiding and opting out for all those years before I started making healthy changes. I think at the heart of that was a lot of, know, shame has come up in this series quite a bit because we've all been through it. I felt like
Alicia (07:36)
Yep. Yep.
Heather Mcginley (07:39)
I, people wouldn't like me if they got to know the real me, that there was something wrong with the real me. And so it was almost like I was hiding that entire way, just trying to get through life. But I wasn't being real with myself or other people because I, and the funny thing is there was nothing to not like. It's just like this deep, this deep insecurity with who I was and the things I'd been through in my life that I was ashamed of. And I didn't want other people to see it.
Alicia (08:02)
that resonates like a thousand percent, like you nailed it there, a thousand percent. And that hasn't disappeared for me either. Something that triggers me is conflict. I can't stand conflict when I inadvertently
Heather Mcginley (08:13)
Yeah.
Alicia (08:25)
hurt a friend's feelings, go, that's how I spiral. Because, you know, it like who doesn't want to be liked, you know? Right, right, exactly. Exactly. Exactly. So that absolutely resonates with me. That's, that's core.
Heather Mcginley (08:33)
Right, especially with your friends. We need them.
Now for you,
you know 20 years ago, you were feeling lost, things were not working for you. What pushed you to make a change and to start your recovery journey?
Alicia (08:53)
Yeah, so I didn't make that decision. didn't make that decision. Like I mentioned, I was living in Colorado. I'm a born and raised New Yorker. I'll always be a New Yorker, like to the core. you know, although I was thousands of miles away and hiding, looping it back around, you know, my friends and family weren't seeing that every day.
Heather Mcginley (08:56)
⁓ okay.
Yes.
Alicia (09:19)
But when I did connect with them, they knew something was wrong. I was in my oblivion, two o'clock in the morning, I would call them hysterical crying and oblivious. they would check on me the next day and I would avoid, I would avoid, I wouldn't pick up the phone. So that's all to say. ⁓
It wasn't my choice. had an intervention with my closest friends and family. And, you know, I came up with every, you know, every reason why I shouldn't go to treatment. You know, I have a dog, who's going to take care of the dog? I have a job, who's going to, you know, I'm going to lose my job. So, you know, they...
Heather Mcginley (09:45)
Okay.
Yeah.
Alicia (10:07)
because they helped to love me, you know, until I could love myself. So was really the love of them that saw that like, know your life doesn't have to be like this. So that was the push.
Heather Mcginley (10:22)
That is so beautiful.
That is so wonderful that they did that. Did you feel a sense of relief or were you upset about it or both?
Alicia (10:31)
Both, absolutely. remember Clara's day, I was on the phone with one or two of my best friends outside of the office, like literally outside of the front door of the office. And she's like, you know, I can't support you in your sickness anymore.
You know, I will support you in your health, a thousand percent, but I cannot do this anymore. You need help. You need help. So it was at that point where I finally surrendered and said, you know what? Like, what if, what if life really doesn't have to be like this? What if, what if? So it was just that little glimmer of,
Heather Mcginley (11:09)
Mm-hmm.
Alicia (11:15)
of hope that, you know, was like, you know what? Okay, I give up on like how life is going now because the choice there was, you know, jail, substitution and death. there was no, if I didn't get the help I needed, not to be overly dramatic, but like, I don't think I would be sitting here today. I truly do not think I would be. It would either be by choice to leave.
or by, you know, what was in my system. So yeah.
Heather Mcginley (11:47)
Right,
Yeah, I mean, you're not over, well, first of all, this is your story. And so, yes, that is absolutely correct. I hear that I get it it's 100 % true. a couple of my close, people close to me have been working through addiction. Some of them have not gotten to that point yet. And it is...
Alicia (11:54)
A thousand percent,
Heather Mcginley (12:06)
What you said is exactly what I think and it makes me so sad. It's like, really wish life wasn't like this for you. Cause I see how hard it is. Like I see how hard it is and how devastating. And I did have a conversation with one of the people close to me and we did talk about this. And I said, you know, like in the gentlest way possible, so hard. I think when you're on the other side of it as someone who's a loved one is I don't want to add. Cause I know that you're, at least in my case, the people close to me dealing with shame.
Alicia (12:32)
Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (12:33)
and things like that. I don't want to add to that. It's coming from a place of love. I want them to see tomorrow. And I had that conversation with them. And I remember I said, a lot of us are really worried that one day we're going to get a phone call and you're not going to be here anymore. And I don't know if you realize how serious this is. I think you've gotten used to it. It's become your normal. But from the outside, we can see how this is hurting you. We see what this is doing to you. And we are so worried about you.
Alicia (12:39)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (13:01)
And what was interesting is he was absolutely surprised. He's like, what? It's not, it's that bad? I was like, yeah, it is that bad. I mean, did you have that kind of experience being on the other side of it? Or were you like, I get it and I understand what you're saying. Cause I know everyone's different.
Alicia (13:05)
Mmm.
Mm-hmm.
No,
you made something click with me and I want to retract on what I said. Yes, it wasn't my idea to go to treatment, but ultimately it was my choice because I had that split moment of like, okay, let's give this a shot. I wasn't like forced on the plane. Like for this person that you're speaking about, you could...
Heather Mcginley (13:30)
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
Alicia (13:42)
tell them how much you care, how much you love them a thousand times. And they have to want it for themselves. You can't do this for somebody else because guess what? You're not gonna succeed. I truly believe that. It has to be that you're sick and tired of being sick and tired and just that what if.
Heather Mcginley (13:51)
Yeah.
Yeah, and you were ready. You were ready to make that, to make that move.
Alicia (14:09)
Right, yeah, yeah. It took that tough love, like, you know, I'm not going to be here if you keep choosing this path. I can't be here for that.
Heather Mcginley (14:18)
Yeah.
Now for people who don't know much about it, what is the recovery process look like? Is it ever something that's over? Is it something that happens for the rest of your life? What is recovery? What does that journey look
Alicia (14:33)
it looks different for everybody. That looks completely different for everybody. And it's for me, it's constantly evolving where I was 19 years ago. I was, you know, like I was in treatment for 30 day treatment in Arizona. I continued to, to treatment in California. I never left. I'm in San Diego, for, for several months, but
What does recovery look like for me? It's never ending. It really is never ending because those uncomfortable feelings never ended, you know? But what it looks like is like grabbing what I know works to get through it. It's looking back.
at who that person was before, like really that person. have so much empathy for her, but it scares me to death to go back to that life. So looking forward and being present is key, really. ⁓
Heather Mcginley (15:32)
Yeah.
Now what were some of the biggest lessons you learned throughout recovery?
Alicia (15:50)
Biggest lessons we touched upon being present, myself grace, you know, life is messy, period. Like hard stop, and that's okay. ⁓ Right, right, exactly. It has taught me resilience.
Heather Mcginley (15:55)
Yeah.
Yeah, ain't that the truth
Alicia (16:09)
It has taught me that I don't need to do this alone. It has taught me to, even though I'm an introvert, has taught me to, it has taught me that if I'm doing the things I love, I'm gonna find my people and those people are gonna help lift me up. Not with words, but with that connection again. Art, I have...
very special connections with other artists who just simply get it. And through that, you know, that might be the first connection. And through that, I've built these deeper connections of other people who are going through recovery or other people who are active in their addiction and just having that, you know, that like, hey, me too, you know, and that feels really good when you hear somebody else say like, me too.
Ha ha!
Heather Mcginley (17:02)
Yeah,
yeah, I mean, I think we're giving each other some life-old moments today, because you're now giving me something that's clicking. You're making me think about a conversation I had with someone recently. Again, we were talking about sharing our stories, and you know, we were talking about the value of, he said to me, like, well, you're just starting to tell your story. And my reaction was, that's interesting. I feel like I'm very open.
Alicia (17:22)
Hmm.
Heather Mcginley (17:25)
talk about, you know, things I've been through. And then I thought about, was like, he is right. I think in some ways I'm still hiding. Like there are things about my story that like just, it's not oversharing. Like everybody doesn't need to know everything about your life really. It's more like how you feel about, like for me, there's things in my life that I'm uncomfortable talking about because I have unresolved feelings about it.
Alicia (17:32)
Hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (17:46)
You know,
and so I was like, he is, he saw something that I didn't see. He's right. I am just starting to be more open about my life, my story, my upbringing, the things that I'm dealing with. And the times that I have, you're talking about me too, how powerful that is. the times that I have been, you know, able to talk about something real in my life that was maybe kind of hard for me to talk about. I have been shocked. are.
Alicia (17:53)
Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (18:10)
Without fail, there have been at least one or two other people that say, I know what you're talking about. That happened to me too. You know, I'm, I'm, I'm proud of you that you're here today. I'm happy. You know, it's like, so, so funny, those things that you're so scared about, maybe you like hang onto it for a long time and then you finally start talking about it. The, the relief and the pride and the openness and freedom you feel afterwards for me, at least was shocking. Cause I, that ability to be
Alicia (18:20)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (18:38)
to have that connection with someone else around a common shared experience is so powerful.
Alicia (18:46)
And that didn't come easy for me either because I don't often have the words to express. I feel a lot and I will put that into art. And when I say put that into art, it's not like I'm thinking like, I'm feeling dah, dah, dah, I'm putting it out there. It's just like a release.
Heather Mcginley (18:51)
Yeah.
Alicia (19:08)
You know, and it's through recovery that I've learned to identify what, you know, what is that feeling? Let me not be scared to go deeper into like, where is that coming from? Because through treatment, I like, peeled away a lot because like, that's what treatment is, is going where I didn't want to go.
Heather Mcginley (19:08)
Yeah.
Alicia (19:35)
and having those people help me understand, like, you know, how does this fit with this? Like, that makes sense, you know, and something that happened earlier in my life. Okay, I see how that connects now and how that could be different and how that doesn't have to define me today. And how can that help me be better, you know? And through that and having that understanding of my life, you know, could really help somebody else.
Heather Mcginley (19:42)
Mm-hmm.
Alicia (20:04)
You know, and that's not a conscious thing. It's just through conversation and having that. You know, it's really a beautiful thing. It really is.
Heather Mcginley (20:05)
Yeah.
Well, it is and it really is like you're connecting a lot of dots for me right now too, because I think those things that like you said, that are hard to talk about or even acknowledge, it's kind of funny when you go to therapy, you have to be careful. Cause if you like are getting to know a new therapist and you're like, this, you know, but I don't really want to talk about that. I'm, if don't say that because then the therapist is going to say, well, that's where we're starting. That's where the problem is. ⁓
Alicia (20:28)
Yep.
Yup. Yup. Yup.
Absolutely. Absolutely. no, rehab was like 24 seven. Exactly that. Exactly that. Yeah. Yeah. And like I, you know, looking back, obviously in the moment that it was, it was hard, but like, it just cracked me open. It cracked me open as raw.
Heather Mcginley (20:42)
You're like, again.
Yeah.
Alicia (20:57)
It was raw, it was messy, but it's what I needed, you know?
Heather Mcginley (21:02)
Yeah. Well, and we've been talking to you about connecting to other people, but the way that you're talking right now, it's also about connecting to yourself. Like it's, like, I'm trying to reject pieces of my history and who I am, like to myself. I don't know what the word is, like rejecting yourself, you know? ⁓ I'm having a lot of light bulb moments today that I was not expecting Alicia.
Alicia (21:19)
Mm. Mm-hmm.
I love that.
Heather Mcginley (21:25)
But yeah, no, that
Alicia (21:25)
I love that.
Heather Mcginley (21:26)
is true. you know, like we do, we talk so much about connecting to other people, which is of course vital. You don't get, nobody gets through life alone, or you shouldn't. But it's also about how do you connect to yourself? What are the parts of you that you're ashamed of, the parts that you reject, the parts you don't want to talk about, or that you don't want to acknowledge? And going through that process, you know, whether in recovery, rehab, through a therapeutic process, because we all have it.
Alicia (21:33)
Right, right.
Hmm.
Heather Mcginley (21:50)
Like I would love to meet the person who hasn't been through shit. Who is that person? They're probably really boring. They're A, probably pretty boring, but very rare, you know? And so it's like, what are the things in your life that, you know, like if you're having a reaction of, I just pretended it didn't happen, or I didn't think about it, or I don't want to talk about it. Not that you need to overshare, but that means something. That means there is something there that even if it's just you and your therapist, or you and your journal,
Alicia (21:54)
Yeah, no. Yeah, no. Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Heather Mcginley (22:16)
probably something to look at and connect to yourself in a better way. That is so interesting. Now you've talked so much about your art and because I know Alicia, because I know Alicia, I know that you are very prolific. Her artwork is colorful, it is beautiful, it is very energetic and there's a lot of emotion to it. So that's why I really wanna encourage everyone to go look at my social account and watch the video of this so you can see some of it and then follow her online.
Alicia (22:19)
Mm-hmm.
Heather Mcginley (22:41)
Can you talk to us about the connection and the role that art played in your recovery?
Alicia (22:47)
Yeah, so like I mentioned, art has always been an anchor for me. I really feel it's something that I was just born with. But and through the evolution of my recovery, it's taken different forms. But most recently, you know, at the at the top of the hour, you mentioned like, ⁓ my art name is She Posse. And that has been
Heather Mcginley (22:56)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Alicia (23:15)
really another very definitive chapter in my life that I'm living right now. And so that started with coming to the realization. And so Shepasi, the form that is taken now is street art. And so I was thinking a lot.
Heather Mcginley (23:32)
Yeah.
Alicia (23:36)
prior to this interview, know, how am I gonna relate street art to recovery? And it really is interesting because the parallels are, I mean, really uncanny. mean, animinity is built into both street art and recovery. ⁓ Anybody.
Heather Mcginley (23:58)
yeah, you're right. I'm realizing
that right now too as you say that.
Alicia (24:01)
Yeah,
yeah, anybody could suffer addiction. It doesn't matter how old, where, when, how, race, doesn't matter. Street art, anybody could draw on label. Anybody could have a piece of paper and glue it to a wall. Anybody. You don't have to, you know.
Heather Mcginley (24:27)
Yeah.
Alicia (24:29)
goes through curation of a gallery, recovery, feelings come and go. know, it's nothing stays forever. On the street, nothing stays forever. You could put up a sticker, you could put up, we paste, it could be gone in a few months, it could be gone in five minutes. So it's,
you know, it's a release of emotion and just putting it out there and whatever happens happens. So I think I only found that recently to put into words. and also there is a very strong community in recovery. An important part that I didn't mention is that
12 step meetings got me by, you know, a thousand percent. I surrounded myself with other women who had, know, the story was a little bit different, but the core of it was the same and building the connection there. In street art, there's a very unique community there that's very supportive and that, you know.
Heather Mcginley (25:13)
Yeah.
Alicia (25:34)
really it's because of that community that I keep going, you know, because we have this common bond and because we look out for one another on the streets. yeah, it's down that I've given it some thought. It really is interesting, the parallels and the draw there.
Heather Mcginley (25:50)
Yeah.
Yeah,
I think sometimes the universe brings us to places that we don't exactly understand, but it feels right. So we follow that feeling and then later we get it. We put all the pieces together and we're like, now I know what was going on there. Which Alicia and I talked a little bit about that experience before we started recording.
But what you're describing sounds very much like that because now that you talk about it, you are so right. Like street art is so raw and vulnerable and accessible. It really, and your art I think is very a great example of this. it's very visceral. It's very visceral. it's beautifully done, but it's not, there's not a mask on it.
Alicia (26:29)
Mm.
Heather Mcginley (26:34)
if that makes sense, like the mask is off, or at least from what I see as a consumer of your art. sometimes I think there's art that is very controlled and it feels like there's a veil between the feelings and emotion and creativity of the artist and the output, which that's one kind of art that's really interesting. Yours, I feel that is removed, like the veil is removed. I really see into what you're feeling, what you're thinking, what the purpose and the intention is before you put it out into the world and let it go.
Alicia (26:35)
Mmm.
Heather Mcginley (26:58)
And it is, you're right, that is exactly recovery. you were talking about being in recovery and going into the tough parts and opening things up that you had been ignoring, becoming vulnerable, it is such a tangible representation of that. It is fascinating.
Alicia (27:14)
Yeah, let you know, Heather, don't, I rarely hear people talk about my art because it's just out in the street, you know, ⁓ it's for the public, you know, I don't get that feedback because I don't know what have, because I don't know, you know, I don't know who's going to see it. I'm not going to, you know,
Heather Mcginley (27:23)
Yeah, it's great.
⁓ right, right.
Alicia (27:39)
run into that person because they don't know who I am. You know, so it's, I appreciate that, know, your perspective on it. I do it just because I enjoy it, you know. Sometimes I have an idea to sit down and just get out, but a lot of times it,
Heather Mcginley (27:43)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Alicia (28:03)
I just, you know, have an itch to go downstairs and play with color, you know, and it just makes me feel better.
Heather Mcginley (28:08)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'm going to backtrack a little bit. Street art, so the kind of the thing, so Alicia does make, will make pieces, you know, like prints that, But then a lot of what Alicia does, they might be stickers. They might be, you know, Alicia mentioned this before, like, ⁓ might create a piece that she can glue to, you know, publicly out. And it may stick around to your point, or it may, ⁓ you know, someone may take it, which is great. That is part of the experience that you are putting together.
It could be stickers. could be, it's all public art and it is anonymous, know, except for, know, we know She Posse did it. So if they look you up on Instagram, they'll be able to figure it out. But it is very public. It is very accessible. is very, I don't know, uncurated isn't exactly the right word. It is like of the people. That's a, that's a good phrase for it, is of the people. Now, can you talk about where did your name She Posse come from? How did you come to that name?
Alicia (29:00)
Very organically, very organically, very, very organically. In 2021, I hopped onto Shepherd Ferry's Discord. He had a project going on at the time. He's an artist that I've admired for some time. And so I went onto his Discord, which is anonymous.
Heather Mcginley (29:02)
The best way.
Alicia (29:22)
and interacting with the community there. people would always refer to me as dude, bro, he, him. And because it's an anonymous platform, gender's just assumed. I...
Heather Mcginley (29:31)
⁓ yeah.
Right, and that's
usually assumed to be a man.
Alicia (29:41)
It's usually seem
to be a man because street art, know, graffiti and stickers, you know, it's, you know, it very much is like a boys game, but females are out there. We're out there. We don't get the shine. We're out there. So when I say it happened organically was because I was consistently being referred to as, you know, the wrong gender, the wrong pronoun.
So I started saying, where's my sheep posse at? Like, I know you're out here. Where's my sheep posse at? If relating it to, I don't know if you're familiar with Shepherd's Ferry. Andre the Giant has a posse. Right.
Heather Mcginley (30:13)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, so I am actually for you. Like I knew who he was, alright, but then like
also I got to know him better through you actually. So yes, I am. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alicia (30:29)
okay.
So it's because it was on his discord, you know, it just where's my sheep has yet and so it was literally a chorus of like, here I am, here I am, here I am. And, like this collective voice that like, hey, you know, women are out here to women could like street art. And because I'm a designer, because I'm an artist, I started playing off of his sticker.
Heather Mcginley (30:49)
Yeah, yeah.
Alicia (30:56)
that became notorious and just making my own stickers, you know, based on sheep posse. And it kind of just grew from there.
Heather Mcginley (30:58)
Mm-hmm.
That's great.
Now some of your pieces, now we already talked about this subject earlier, but I'll just share this quote, and if you have anything else you want to add, because I don't want to miss this, because I think this is beautiful quote from you. I have two quotes I want to share from your artwork, because some of your artwork includes quotes or words. One of them was, recovery didn't make me perfect, it made me present.
Can you talk a little bit about embracing mistakes, about what that quote means to you?
Alicia (31:29)
Right, well, you know, just because I went from using, being active in my addiction to recovery doesn't make me perfect. It does not make me perfect. But understanding that I don't have to be perfect, it's a matter, you know, it's...
It's just taking one step in front of the other and being present with that. That brings it back to my art because when I'm present, when I'm working on a piece, it doesn't have to be perfect. It does not have to be perfect whatsoever, but I'm getting it out there. I'm getting it out of my system. I'm putting it out in the world. And when I put it out in the world, I'm present. It's just like,
That pole looks good. Boop. I'm in the moment. Yeah, I'm there. That wall looks good. Boop. I'm going to put it up. So that's where it kind of parallels.
Heather Mcginley (32:14)
⁓ You are there.
And I like this other quote, and I'm gonna, if you all watch the video, this is really an episode everyone needs to watch on video, because in the video you're gonna see, I'm gonna put this one up. There's another one you have that says, I create from recovery, I create for those who feel invisible. Can you say more about that experience? Because I thought that was an interesting quote.
Alicia (32:40)
Yeah, you know, when I'm creating, it's a lot of times, and it's not illustrative, it's more of the feeling when I'm creating, but putting into it the things I used to hide, you know, and that...
and again, bringing it back to the present moment. So, yeah.
Heather Mcginley (33:03)
I think it's great. All right, so this show is all about the idea that life's endings can bring us to a new beginning. How do you interpret that idea?
Alicia (33:12)
I interpret that as things could be messy, but don't give up on it before you see the rainbow. If I didn't go through the mess, I wouldn't have known that life could be this colorful. And it's about allowing yourself to make mistakes.
and just be in the moment of making that mistake and moving on.
Heather Mcginley (33:39)
love it. Now if you could, you you have been through so much over the last couple decades, you've learned so much, you've created so much. Your life has changed a lot. When you look back to that younger Alicia from 20 years ago that was going through so much, what would you want to say to her?
Alicia (33:56)
You're not broken. You just need help. Help is out there. And I'm going to repeat myself. Don't give up before you see the rainbow.
Heather Mcginley (34:04)
Great. Now before we close, we're gonna go into making sure everyone can find you and interact with you online and look at more of your art. Is there anything that we didn't cover today that you wanna make sure to say about your journey?
Alicia (34:16)
I learned that if I didn't follow this passion of mine, I, I don't think I would have continued to learn about myself and making those connections, you know, through my recovery, I actually met my husband. ⁓
Heather Mcginley (34:32)
Yeah.
Alicia (34:34)
Through my recovery, I've been able to evolve how I show up in the world today.
You know, we didn't touch upon the shame of addiction and yeah, yeah. You know, there's, in recent years, the stigma is, you know, shifting, but there certainly is a stigma out there when it comes to addiction and mental illness. And I think,
Heather Mcginley (34:44)
yeah.
Let's talk about it.
Alicia (35:08)
Because of that, it holds people back from getting help, because we don't want to be seen as that stigma. But I encourage anybody who's struggling to, mean, there's a wealth of knowledge on the internet to find those connections.
Heather Mcginley (35:26)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alicia (35:29)
There are ⁓ 12 step meetings to find those people. And yeah, I think the more that we share these experiences, the more that people will say, me too, there'll be a better understanding of mental health, of recovery. And I think that's the...
That's the wall between the shame and the stigma is simply not understanding it and having preconceived notions versus people actually speaking up about their experience and, you know, and seeing that it could be anyone. It can look very different. Yeah.
Heather Mcginley (36:06)
Right, right. It can look very different.
Yeah, yeah, it's so sometimes I think things can be missed because and I think it's on purpose. we do so much ⁓ twisting ourselves to avoid shame, to avoid or to avoid the things that we're ashamed of, to avoid things about ourselves that are that are deeply seated and need to be addressed that need to be looked at that are that are rotting on the inside. We had another guest
Alicia (36:18)
Mmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mmm.
Heather Mcginley (36:34)
Kyla Fox earlier in the season, you talked about recovery from eating disorders. And it's interesting, you are both, you know, they're different experiences, but you are both talking about it. And there are certain aspects that are very similar in terms of the way you're talking about. And she was talking about how recovery was really interesting for her because she knew, she knew if I want to live, I've got to get through this, you know, fighting for her life. However, she also had a love.
Alicia (36:38)
Mmm.
a thousand percent.
Heather Mcginley (37:04)
for her eating disorder. And she says just that push and pull of, need to get healthy. I know this is bad for me, but I also love it. I need it. And it's easier in a way ⁓ because I don't wanna deal with these things. And she talked about recovery as she used a metaphor for it. She was like, it's like unboxing or unpacking boxes in my basement.
Alicia (37:14)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yup.
Heather Mcginley (37:27)
is what recovery was like for me and going in and unpacking another box, unpacking another box. And it is so hard and it is so hard, you know, cause it's in the basement. We put the boxes in the basement that we don't want to look at or deal with, right?
Alicia (37:32)
⁓ I love that.
right.
Yup. Yup. Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Heather Mcginley (37:43)
So that whole process, know, it is so hard, which is why I say everyone that's been on this show, at least we're also talking about this, is for real, a literal badass. Like the more I've talked to all of you, you have been through so much, but you are here today. you know, my experience is in a different realm, but I understand how hard it is to fix your life, you know, to learn to love yourself, to get healthy. A lot of people think it's like flipping a light switch, you know, and we get so hard.
Alicia (38:10)
Right.
Heather Mcginley (38:11)
I'll get so hard on ourselves. Like, why did I keep doing this? Why do I keep choosing that? I know it's bad for me. Why do I keep going back to it? And then it's like a spiral, right? Of like shame and like, you know, and you like know it's bad, but then you feel bad about feeling bad. And it's like, it just like goes into a total death spiral. Yes. And one day, the day that that conversation changed for me is when I stopped looking at it as a binary light switch.
Alicia (38:19)
Yup, yup.
Mm-hmm. It's a cycle. It's a cycle.
Mmm.
Heather Mcginley (38:37)
and I looked
at it more like you were talking about having grace for yourself. It's more like going to the gym. It's more like going and lifting weights and you work and you work and you work, you develop a practice and eventually at one point your muscles are stronger. You're doing better. It's more built into your body, but it's a practice. It's a journey. It is not a light switch. And for me, once I used that metaphor for trying to get healthy, that was so much more helpful to me than
Alicia (38:48)
Mm-hmm.
Mmm.
I
love that.
Heather Mcginley (39:08)
Because you just get so hard on yourself. It's like why why it's because it's not that simple like you want it to be that simple, but it's not it's not Sorry, that's not how humans work. You don't just when it's a deep-seated issue. You don't just fix it You don't just like stop doing it. That's not how it works at all
Alicia (39:13)
right right right right
No. Right. Right.
Right. It's really progress over perfection. You know, absolutely.
Heather Mcginley (39:28)
Yeah, yeah. And it's kinder.
It's part of learning to love yourself.
Alicia (39:33)
Yes. Yeah, after, you know, it's funny you say that after treatment, I got a license plate self-heart 19. 19 is a special number between me and my best friend. you know, that could be taken a few ways like, oh, wow, you're really kind of cocky there. But it really was more of a softness and a reminder to myself every literally every single day when I got in my car to give myself grace.
Heather Mcginley (39:44)
Yeah.
Alicia (40:00)
and to know that we're moving forward, we, me. So it was a literal visual reminder, self-love, that's really, and that's what I spoke about earlier too. It was a matter of my friends and family loving me enough until I could love myself.
Heather Mcginley (40:05)
Hopefully, yes.
⁓ that's so beautiful. I love that too. All right, well, Alicia, I wanna thank you so much for being here and I wanna make sure people can find you and I'll put this in the show notes. Where can people find you if they wanna work with you or see some of your art?
Alicia (40:25)
Mm-hmm
Yeah, Instagram, she, S-H-E dot ⁓ P-O-S-S-E. Instagram. Yeah, she posse.
Heather Mcginley (40:43)
Perfect. And I'll
link it in the show notes too. So y'all don't have to furiously write this down. I'll link it in there so you can find her there. And then next week, we're gonna be talking to Ravena Koh and we are flipping the script next week because we're gonna talk about how autism is not an ending at all. So we're gonna talk about something that a lot of people think is an ending when it is not. So we're gonna have that conversation and she's here to help people reframe how they might see autism and to also confront ableist tendencies, which
Alicia (40:59)
you
Heather Mcginley (41:12)
I think we could all do better on that front. So it's going to be a really interesting conversation. And if you enjoyed today's show, you can support us by leaving a like, leave a rating, comment, wherever you're listening to this podcast and subscribe so you don't miss a moment. Thank you to all of you listening to the Happily Never After today, especially for those of you who are on your own journey and we hope you have a great week.